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Old 2016-04-26, 02:54 PM   #1
William393
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36" tire question

Hi,

I noticed the Nightrider tire is described by UDC as "our new 36" tire, has an innovative, cross cut tread pattern that offers a huge improvement in performance and control." It's $82, same price as the Coker Button tire.

Does anyone still buy the Coker Button tire? Why? Is there a big difference? Is it possible the Coker lasts more miles?

I ride on streets and sidewalks, just road, occasional light off road. Is there another time-tested alternative to these 2 tires?

And lets talk tubes while we're at it. I used to use a 29" for lightness, in my 36" tire. I just noticed UDC has the new Nimbus Clear Inner Tube - 36 inch, which it describes as "lightweight ... explosion proof and will form an airtight seal around the nail or glass, slowing down the leak. This gives the rider extra time before they have to fix the leak. ( We have even seen this tube fixed with a lighter.)

unfortunately, these tubes are made from unvulcanized rubber which is lighter than traditional rubber but more porous. This means it is normal to loose 5psi to 10psi a night. (!!!) I MIGHT add air once/month, so this seems like a BIG inconvenience. Is it true? Should I just stick with the 28/29" tube for lightness?

Thoughts appreciated!

William

Last edited by William393; 2016-04-26 at 03:00 PM.
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Old 2016-04-26, 03:03 PM   #2
UniDreamerFR
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There is also a light version of the TA tire (q-ax), at about the same weight as the nightrider tire (around 1700-1800gm) which is good for road and sidewalks.
Now that it is lighter the only downside is that the max PSI is about 32PSI even though some people have been inflating it much more.
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Old 2016-04-26, 03:15 PM   #3
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You may find some reports about long time road usage here on the forum with this tire 36" Vee rubber tire.

The Vee Rubber Offroad tire has a tread pattern that lies between a Kenda Nevegal and Schwalbe Racing Ralph in terms of tread depth and design, creating good grip across a wide range of terrain and conditions while maximizing speed off-road and on. Tapered and ramped center knobs along with ramped transition knobs provide traction and control, while tie bars connecting the triangular transition knobs to side knobs help with cornering.

Features:

Size: 36 X 2.25 inches, to fit 787mm rim
Construction: 2-ply
Pressure Rating: 65PSI (32-40psi works great)
Weight: 1625g +/-40g
Tubeless Ready: Yes
Bead: Wire
TPI: 36

I haven't ridden it that much, and most of the time offroad but I am really happy with it so far.
I also use a FOSS tube with it. Lightweigth, durable and only small loss of air (noticed no big difference to my other munis)

Greetings

Byc
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Last edited by Byc; 2016-04-26 at 03:17 PM.
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Old 2016-04-26, 04:35 PM   #4
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I like the tried and true nightrider. somehow in thousands and thousands of miles, I have yet to get a flat. I have a 29+ tube in it right now, and it works well. It's half way in between the foss tube and the standard tube weight. It still loses air a little, but it's not bad.

There's the coker road tire too, if you only do occasional/lite off-road, but I've found the nightrider to be very capable at everything I've thrown at it. Kinda looking forward to trying it out on the 32 when it comes out. my guess is that it'll be a great rugged muni tire outside of the mud. I haven't ridden my 36er offroad except for some smooth singletrack. The 32 though... could get down and dirty.
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Old 2016-04-26, 04:38 PM   #5
janvanhulzen
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I have a qu-ax with the TA tire but switched to the nightrider tire. The cross pattern is ok but you will notice that small pebbles will get stuck in there and you have to remove them after riding.

An advantage of the nightrider is that it can be inflated to somewhat higher pressures and is faster than the TA. Riding with high pressure increases sensitivity to bumps. I found out the hard way…

All in all i think it is worth the investment.
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Old 2016-04-26, 10:06 PM   #6
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As everyone has already mentioned about the tyre choices, I'll speak about the tube

The FOSS clear 36er tube is about as light as running a 29er tube (obviously depending on the 29er tube used) and is supposedly amazing at dealing with punctures. Weirdly since I got it (must be a bit over a year ago now) I've not had a single puncture - whether that's just extreme luck, or the tube is automagically mending them, I'm not sure (And I'm not about to pull my tyre off to check).

It doesn't lose PSI as much as you say - I pump it up every couple of weeks. I run it fairly hard (About 45-50PSI on a TA tyre) and haven't had any issues with this setup.

Do be warned, there are stories floating about online about these tubes spontaneously combusting! It's usually a failure around the valve, as it tries to push out of the (sharp-edged metal) valve hole in your rim. It's not happened to me yet and I'm crossing my fingers...

It seems the Nightrider tyre is about the best 36er tyre right now - the newer, lighter TA tyre may be great, the original TA is awesomely smooth for road and I'm sure losing weight from it can only help, but I've never tried so won't comment much further than that. There is another tyre from Qu-Ax but no one seems to have bothered testing it (It's called a King George), mostly due to it being more expensive than the nightrider and an unproven design.
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Old 2016-04-26, 10:20 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Piece Maker View Post
Do be warned, there are stories floating about online about these tubes spontaneously combusting! It's usually a failure around the valve, as it tries to push out of the (sharp-edged metal) valve hole in your rim. It's not happened to me yet and I'm crossing my fingers...
I had a Foss tube failure from trying to run it in a Coker rim. The valve hole was just too big, and the tube blew out right where the valve stem meets the tube. I got a replacement and tried to reinforce that spot with a plastic washer to fill the gap. Still pretty much instant failure. So I went back to a 29'r tube and didn't have any problems. So if you're running a different rim that has a better (tighter) fitting valve stem hole, then you're probably good. (The stock 36" tube is nearly bulletproof, but man is it thick and heavy!)
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Old 2018-03-11, 04:16 PM   #8
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New video showing a detailed comparison between the new Knightrider "Lite" 36er tire and Vee rubber tube vs the original, much heavier Nightrider tire and tube. I used an electronic hanging scale which was pre-calibrated for optimum accuracy. The total weight savings between the tires and tubes is "off the scale" dramatic! (At about 2:45 into the video I made a mistake by saying "3.9 Ounces" when I should have said 3 lb 9 oz.)

For those outside the US, I included total weight savings in grams in the video and YouTube description. (Hint: it exceeds 1kg!)

https://youtu.be/bMOVMzhdsJE
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Last edited by MuniAddict; 2018-03-11 at 04:19 PM.
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Old 2018-03-11, 10:43 PM   #9
Snoopy 16
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Tubless 36

I have my KH36 set up Tubless using Stans-no-tube. It works well for me & I have never had a flat in my Nightrider tire.
Are there any others who have gone tubless on their 36?

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Old 2018-03-12, 01:14 AM   #10
lightbulbjim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MuniAddict View Post
New video showing a detailed comparison between the new Knightrider "Lite" 36er tire and Vee rubber tube vs the original, much heavier Nightrider tire and tube. I used an electronic hanging scale which was pre-calibrated for optimum accuracy. The total weight savings between the tires and tubes is "off the scale" dramatic! (At about 2:45 into the video I made a mistake by saying "3.9 Ounces" when I should have said 3 lb 9 oz.)

For those outside the US, I included total weight savings in grams in the video and YouTube description. (Hint: it exceeds 1kg!)

https://youtu.be/bMOVMzhdsJE
Thanks! What's the diameter of the valve stem on the new tube? I currently have a Foss tube on my 36er but was under the impression that the standard rubber tube had a thicker valve stem.

I don't suppose anybody knows the weight of a 36" Foss tube off the top of their head? On UDC it just says "30% lighter than a standard tube", but it would be good to have some real world numbers.

A standard tube appeals to me because the Foss is pretty fragile and I'm not looking forward to the day I need to patch it in the middle of nowhere.

BTW Terry, is that a Gentle Lady hanging from you ceiling?
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Old 2018-03-12, 02:39 AM   #11
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For the Presta Valve I drilled a 6mm hole which fits perfectly, and plugged the Schrader hole which is now covered with the rim strip and which was far too large for the standard Presta adapter. The V rubber 36er tube is actually lighter then the FOSS tube and also less prone to failure or leaking. So with the new Knightrider Lite Tire ( which I'm calling the "Lightrider" ☺ ) and Vee rubber tube combination I've dropped nearly two and a half pounds of weight off of the wheel which is pretty significant.
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Last edited by MuniAddict; 2018-03-12 at 02:43 AM.
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Old 2018-03-12, 02:56 AM   #12
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Oh, it's Presta? I missed that bit. Even better!
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Old 2018-03-12, 03:39 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lightbulbjim View Post
Thanks! What's the diameter of the valve stem on the new tube? I currently have a Foss tube on my 36er but was under the impression that the standard rubber tube had a thicker valve stem.

I don't suppose anybody knows the weight of a 36" Foss tube off the top of their head? On UDC it just says "30% lighter than a standard tube", but it would be good to have some real world numbers.....
The Foss tube weighs 247g / .54lb per the UDC site. The new tube weighs 220g. That's a little less then 1oz lighter. Weight is kind of a trade off. I guess it boils down to holding air better in the new Butyl tube or the self sealing capability of a Foss.

You can get a Schrader-Presta, rubber rim hole adapter online or from your LBS. So a new smaller hole does not have the be drilled in the rim.

Jim
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Old 2018-03-12, 04:42 AM   #14
lightbulbjim
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The Foss tube weighs 247g / .54lb per the UDC site. The new tube weighs 220g. That's a little less then 1oz lighter. Weight is kind of a trade off. I guess it boils down to holding air better in the new Butyl tube or the self sealing capability of a Foss.

You can get a Schrader-Presta, rubber rim hole adapter online or from your LBS. So a new smaller hole does not have the be drilled in the rim.

Jim
Thanks. I've seen those adapters, and that's probably the way I would go.
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Old 2018-03-12, 09:53 PM   #15
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Vee rubber 36er tube weight update!

The claimed weight on every website I've checked indicate 220 grams. The weight I kept coming up with was a bit under 340 grams. That's a pretty big difference. I called the Vee rubber company here in the US and ask them if they could confirm the actual weight and they responded fairly quickly saying it was indeed 330 grams. This is still less than half the weight of the original butyl rubber 36er tube which weighs in at 709g. So although it turned out that it's not 220 grams, 330g isn't bad.
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