UNICON XV MUni Race Results & Uni Setups

[Lutz]

I can understand that you are upset about the way it worked. But I still think that randomizing is the best way to do it if the riders cant figure it out in which group they belong themself.
I would have been upset if they had put me in the second starting group just because I saw the list where I had to put my name in to late or if I had to be in a crowdet groupstart with over 30 people because they just put everybody in the first group (extialy I started in the second starting group because I hurt my knee before the race and told Conny that I dont want to be in the first group if I cant ride 100%).
I am also a little bit upset that so many rider thought there where fast and put there name on the list even in the end they are not even in the top 20.
But you cant make everybody happy and I am glad that atleast the XC track stayed at the hard course.

[unicycle6869]

Originally Posted by Lutz

I can understand that you are upset about the way it worked. But I still think that randomizing is the best way to do it if the riders cant figure it out in which group they belong themself.
I would have been upset if they had put me in the second starting group just because I saw the list where I had to put my name in to late or if I had to be in a crowdet groupstart with over 30 people because they just put everybody in the first group (extialy I started in the second starting group because I hurt my knee before the race and told Conny that I dont want to be in the first group if I cant ride 100%).
I am also a little bit upset that so many rider thought there where fast and put there name on the list even in the end they are not even in the top 20.
But you cant make everybody happy and I am glad that atleast the XC track stayed at the hard course.

Randomizing is fine but they should have taken all riders and randomized them together so all groups had some fast and some slow. How did Connie let you race in the 2nd group after you were in the first group? She told me that it couldn't be changed...did you find out the starting order and rule change more than an hour before the race? Just curious... And I agree the XC hard course was awesome!

And any serious competitor should read the rulebook pamphlet that you get when you pick up your registration packet so they know the rules and other important info like signing up to be in the first group. And/or check the bulletin board daily for any updates...It took several days before the sign-up sheet was full so no excuse for not signing up on time!

[Lutz]

I hurt my knee 3 days before the start of the race so I told it Conny 3 days before because I already knew that there where way to much people on the first group list.
We have to figure something out to solve this starting group problem next time. I can completly understand that you didnt like it the way it was. I just wanted to point out that there usualy is no way to satisfie everybody.

[unicycle6869]

Oh ok. That makes sense Lutz. And yes we need to find a way that works. I think we have three options.
1)start everyone at the same time if there is enough room. Have a big wide field that hopefully doesn't narrow to single track right away but fireroad. This would be best case as then it's fair to everyone but not always an option depending on the course and how many people sign up.
2)when people register have a tick box for the serios racers that think they have a chance to place in the top 3. Then the organizers will know how many people need to start in group one to make sure it will work. If there isn't enough room then they will have to do option 3.
3)take all racers and randomize everyone into groups. The thing I don't like about this is the front groups get a huge advantage as they won't need to pass people but it is luck of the draw.
4)I guess there is a fourth option and that is starting everyone at one minute intervals like the downhill was run. But that's no fun to watch nor race as u are racing against the clock instead of riders.

So my vote would be for option 1 or 2. Then option 3 and 4 if 1 or 2 doesn't work. Does that seem legit?

[johnfoss]

Let's look at this from a historical perspective. The XC race at Unicon XIV was a starting area disaster. Basically you had to be lucky to have had a chance in that race. You absolutely had to be an excellent sprinter, probably near the middle of the starting area, and with no sloppy riders around you. Rules were drafted to help avoid that situation, and many improvements were made. The Unicon XV race was broken into groups to avoid the problems of Unicon XIV.

Originally Posted by unicycle6869

1)start everyone at the same time if there is enough room.

This is the best way to work a head-to-head race, but is limited by number of participants. Even with a big field like we had in Wellington, 100 riders would have made it too messy for the first lap, especially in the singletrack sections. Though I believe there's a time when being stuck behind someone on singletrack is just a part of the race, this only holds true when it's broken up by places were passing can occur.

So that first option should work in most cases, except at the very big events (like Unicon). But with 100+ riders, even doing 1 km of dirt road would favor the sprinters, leaving the slower riders, who might be much better climbersand more fit, struggling to pass 50 riders with too much of a crowd for it to be considered "even".

2)when people register have a tick box for the serios racers that think they have a chance to place in the top 3.

This works as long as the self-elected fasties don't exceed the space in the firsts starting group. Nobody knows who's the fastest. Can't even compare to last year, when one guy may have been at peak fitness, while this year he didn't train and someone else is maximally fit. Most riders know roughly where they fit in, but that leaves many that have no idea.

3)take all racers and randomize everyone into groups.

This carries the disadvantage you mentioned, plus it makes for a much less interesting spectator event, and less fun for the top riders.

4)1-minute intervals.

But then it's not a mass-start race, it's a Time Trial. That doesn't solve the problem you're having in your rant. And you would still have to pass lots of slower riders if the starts are random.

You forgot this one:
5) Preliminary race. It doesn't have to be as long, but needs to be long enough for riders to demonstrate superior fitness level beyond sprinting. Should be a sample of what's found on the main race course. For the Unicon XV course, a simple one would be to do one lap. Can be held days before, or hours before, so riders aren't all tuckered out. Could even be done in the form of a workshop, as part of a MUni outing, if a few officials are present to maintain order and record the results. Top riders from the qualifying race go in Group 1. If there are riders who can't make it to a much-earlier preliminary race, or have conflicts with other competition events, they can request Group 1 based on space. People who were slow in the preliminary race don't need to be in Group 1.

It's more complicated, but it's the only way I can think of to get all the actual fastest riders into one group.

I would give them a break but not going to on this one because there was an easy solution.

Good luck with that. I will point out that the race in question is now in the past, and cannot be changed. All that can be changed is the future, so for best results work on future changes.

[unicycle6869]

Waiting for your input John! Thanks for sharing. I do like your choice 5 if it's possible. Yes it's a bit more work but seems legit. If that's not an option I'd go for option 2 and just try and make sure the start has enough room for all enteries. Yes, it does favor sprinters for the first part but if it's a long race, then it won't make a big difference in the long run.

Oh, and when I said there was an easy solution to the XC, I meant that there was enough room to add an additional 5 or even 10 people to the first group. You could even have 2 lines for the first group but start them at the same time. Sure it might get tight but it would have sorted itself out by the start of the first single track.

[natosha]

This is un-related to most of the conversation on this thread and probably a silly question (so forgive my ignorance), but I am curious: Is there no female category for the unicon competitions? Why not? Are there just not enough women competing?

[johnfoss]

Women aren't allowed at Unicon.

No, not really. We really wish some would show up!

[saskatchewanian]

I just read the whole thread. Interesting subjects being breached here.

I was most interested in the subject of running in XC races and the practicability of unicycles as a mode of transportation.



I was really surprised to hear that running was disallowed in the XC race. When I got for rides (I would consider pertnear all my rides XC) I tend to run, a fair amount, and I am not even racing.

Not passing mounted riders sort of makes sense but I remember passing two people (who were riding) in RTL while running up a hill. They made up for it by passing me while I was trying to free-mount with spaghetti legs.



That corresponds quite well with my point of unicycles being a great mode of transportation in a few circumstances. Those circumstances usually involve widely varying terrains where you can ride some parts and need to cary for others. It is easier to carry a unicycle through a swamp or knee deep snow than a bike (I have carried both in both). Skis or even snowshoes would have been much better for most of my last ride except for the gravel section.