why can't unicyclists have it too?

[Palacki808]

I came across this geared hub kit....

http://www.ebikestop.com/sturmey_arc...ver-HU2229.php

It's a little over $100, the cost of a good unicycle hub. Why can't unicyclists have a geared hub for this price too?

[Onions]

We can, but it takes lots of manufacturing work:
http://www.unicyclist.com/forums/showthread.php?t=89581

[maestro8]

Originally Posted by Palacki808

Why can't unicyclists have a geared hub for this price too?

One word.

Torque.

Look into that, how one can design a hub that withstands massive amounts of it, then how to mass-produce such a design... then get back to us on your thoughts of offering such a product for $100.

[Palacki808]

I understand the machining and time involved in such a project. Also, I don't mind spending the money for a well-built uni. Especially when you start looking at the munis with brakes.

It just seems really odd and confusing to me that a geared hub for a bike is less than 1/10 the price of a geared hub for a uni.

[maestro8]

Originally Posted by Palacki808

It just seems really odd and confusing to me that a geared hub for a bike is less than 1/10 the price of a geared hub for a uni.

The bike hub is likely mass-produced.

Schlumpf's hubs are mostly hand-built.

Compare market prices between mass-produced and hand-made for any type of goods: from clothing to automobiles. That 1/10th price differential won't seem so large.

[tholub]

Originally Posted by Palacki808

I understand the machining and time involved in such a project. Also, I don't mind spending the money for a well-built uni. Especially when you start looking at the munis with brakes.

It just seems really odd and confusing to me that a geared hub for a bike is less than 1/10 the price of a geared hub for a uni.

Geared hubs for bikes have a number of things which make them simpler, most notably that they are driven by an outboard chain, and thus can have a shift cable inserted through the outside (where we have a Schlumpf button). Justin's 3-speed build takes advantage of a jackshaft design to be able to use the hub you posted, but you can't just drop it into a unicycle.

It also has a lot more slop than the Schlumpf and has a tendency to shift into neutral, both of which are much more undesirable on a unicycle than on a bike.

If you think this is an easy engineering problem, let's see your design.

[Palacki808]

I never said it was easy, I just found it odd the price was such a huge difference.

[maestro8]

Originally Posted by Palacki808

I just found it odd the price was such a huge difference.

But what's odd about a large price tag on something that is:

1) Swiss-engineered
2) hand-built in small batches in Switzerland
3) built with high-quality materials
4) machined with a high precision
5) used, abused and lauded by many of unicycling's "super stars"
6) supported directly by the manufacturer himself

???

Edit: do you find it odd that a Ferrari costs much more than a Toyota?

[Palacki808]

Wow, I didn't expect to get so attacked over something I thought was interesting. The forum users here didn't seem so juvenile before I joined.

[leo]

Originally Posted by maestro8

1) Swiss-engineered

That's only partially true, which I witnessed myself, when the 1st sketch was drawed on a napkin in a restaurant in Amsterdam, at the end of the day after a bike trade show. Schlumpf only finished this idea that was presented to him there (after he claimed that whole day it was impossible).

[tholub]

Originally Posted by Palacki808

I never said it was easy, I just found it odd the price was such a huge difference.

The price for a top-of-the-line, Schlumpf-equipped MUni is about $2,000. The price for a very good but not top-of-the-line mountain bike is about $5,000. It's odd there's such a huge difference.

[jtrops]

Probably the biggest reason we aren't going to see a geared hub in this price range for a uni lies in the size of the market. There are a lot more bikers out there than unicyclists.

The fixed gear 3 speed hub is a niche item even in the bike community. As much as it's special, it's also pretty ordinary. The guts inside it are borrowed from a hub that has been in production in one form or another for decades, the SA 5 speed. It's really a 5 speed hub that has been stripped down. Considering how niche this thing is I would assume it to be quite a bit more expensive, but since it hasn't really got any new tech, or even parts it was fairly easy to bring it to market. In its current incarnation it is fixed with a bit of freeplay, but it doesn't handle extensive reverse torque. It really doesn't handle much drive torque either. Most internally geared bike hubs are rated for a drive ratio of no less than about 1.8:1. So, a 1:1 input ratio would kill most of these hubs. My S3X has an input ratio of 46:14, or a little better than 3:1.

If there was a stock hub that could easily be stripped down to serve as an internally geared uni hub I think we could see a lower price. Unfortunately, that hub doesn't exist.

[krjames]

Originally Posted by jtrops

Probably the biggest reason we aren't going to see a geared hub in this price range for a uni lies in the size of the market. There are a lot more bikers out there than unicyclists.

The fixed gear 3 speed hub is a niche item even in the bike community. As much as it's special, it's also pretty ordinary. The guts inside it are borrowed from a hub that has been in production in one form or another for decades, the SA 5 speed. It's really a 5 speed hub that has been stripped down. Considering how niche this thing is I would assume it to be quite a bit more expensive, but since it hasn't really got any new tech, or even parts it was fairly easy to bring it to market. In its current incarnation it is fixed with a bit of freeplay, but it doesn't handle extensive reverse torque. It really doesn't handle much drive torque either. Most internally geared bike hubs are rated for a drive ratio of no less than about 1.8:1. So, a 1:1 input ratio would kill most of these hubs. My S3X has an input ratio of 46:14, or a little better than 3:1.

If there was a stock hub that could easily be stripped down to serve as an internally geared uni hub I think we could see a lower price. Unfortunately, that hub doesn't exist.

Thanks for that, that was probably what the OP was expecting to get. Looks like everybody have had a hard week...

Never did understand epicyclic gearing myself, I understand that is what the Schlumpf is.

Of course if you want a cheaper Schlumpf hub I suppose you will have to get Mr Schlumpf to migrate to China!

Life is short,let's ride (or run as the case is).

[saskatchewanian]

Originally Posted by krjames

Of course if you want a cheaper Schlumpf hub I suppose you will have to get Mr Schlumpf to migrate to China!

More likely he would outsource the uni-hub production to Germany.

But the Germans aren't exactly known to make things much cheeper than the Swiss.


EDIT: link

[jtrops]

Originally Posted by krjames

Thanks for that, that was probably what the OP was expecting to get. Looks like everybody have had a hard week...

Never did understand epicyclic gearing myself, I understand that is what the Schlumpf is.

Of course if you want a cheaper Schlumpf hub I suppose you will have to get Mr Schlumpf to migrate to China!

Life is short,let's ride (or run as the case is).

I have to admit, I replied before I read the thread. There isn't a large community of people riding the S3X, and there is probably an even smaller contingent of unicyclists on that hub. So, I figured as a member of both groups I have a perspective that might be different than other posters, or at least some experience with the hub in question.