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View Full Version : Supernatural (not the tv show)/ alien thread


camrocl
2008-12-16, 08:34 AM
Just wondering what your thoughts were on ghosts/ ghouls, things that go bump in the night and even aliens. Anyone experienced any of these strange encounters???

Me, I donít know if I believe in ghosts but one day my mum was driving my granda to the shop. He pointed at a man walking down the road a bit confussed looking and said his name (I'll call him Joe). My mum also saw him. When they went into the shop, the owner asked if they had heard that Joe had died early that morning. This was only 2mins laterÖ.weird

As for aliens. I find it hard to believe that we are the only intelligent life forms in the universe but I donít believe in these aliens (like in Dr. Who?) but rather maybe other humans elsewhere but that they are not aware of us.

I donít know, I thought this would a good idea for a thread as Iím pretty board and wanted to get other peoples opinions.

johnfoss
2008-12-16, 06:23 PM
I believe there's a lot of stuff out there we still don't understand. I also believe in intelligent life elsewhere. However I don't believe we have more than a tiny bit of actual evidence of either. But some people will believe anything.

Every TV show I've ever seen on the subject of ghosts/supernatural occurrences or UFOs is a load of crap. No science, or the appearance of science that isn't really science, to fool some of the people. The UFO shows are the worst. All conspiracy and no fact. Like the 9/11 "Truth" movement.

BTW, I also beleive there is stuff we don't know about the 9/11 attacks, and stuff that was avoided, ignored or whitewashed in the 9/11 Commission reports, but that is not proof of stuff that's alleged without evidence. Some people will believe anything.

I DO believe in the Amityville Horror. Something horrible really, actually happened in that house, and the guy who did it is still in prison. He killed his entire family with a shotgun, while they were sleeping (at least the first one), in 1968 or so. Then he went to the bar at the end of the street and waited for the cops to come get him. I forget his name. He's real. But then, the new owners of this house found out--after they'd bought it--that it was the site of a multiple murder. I don't think they were happy about that. But it gave them the idea for a story. They wrote a book, the book became a movie, the movie became several more movies, and all the while they continued to try to convince people that all the nonsense in their book was true. They made it up. They cleaned up (financially). Then they moved away. The house is still there, but subsequent owners have done some remodeling to discourage tourism. I've been there. It's the least-scary looking house you could imagine. It's at 112 Ocean Avenue, Amityville, NY (http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=112+ocean+avenue,+amityville,+ny&sll=37.0625,-95.677068&sspn=45.601981,74.091797&ie=UTF8&ll=40.666545,-73.414982&spn=0.001341,0.002261&t=h&z=19). Would you have an indian burial ground right next to a creek? It's now a boat canal, but obviously it was not entirely manmade.

Okay, enough of that.

peleschramm
2008-12-16, 06:55 PM
Aliens: yes.

Ghosts/spirits/god: no.I predict I may have just caused a future threadjack.

Goats_On_Unicycles
2008-12-16, 06:58 PM
I believe that there are probably animals/beings of some sort which are invisble to us.
And aliens probably do exist. The chances are good.

Into the blue
2008-12-16, 07:02 PM
The chances of anything coming from Mars are a million to one.

Fraggle
2008-12-16, 07:11 PM
The chances of anything coming from Mars are a million to one.

Lol, but still they come.

I don't believe in ghosts. As for aliens, Earth can't be the only planet with life.

Mikefule
2008-12-16, 07:38 PM
You may be interested in www.forteantimes.com .

I get the magazine each month. It is a fine blend of light hearted and serious, generally sceptical in tone, but for people interested in everything from bigfoot/yeti/sasquatch to ghosts, poltergeists, UFOs, conspiracy theories, Loch Ness monster...

I don't believe in ghosts, but I believe there is a phenomenon we call "ghosts".

I'm fairly sure that there is intelligent life Out There, but I'm not so hopeful about the Search for Terrestrial Intelligence.;)

Fraggle
2008-12-16, 07:42 PM
You may be interested in www.forteantimes.com .

I get the magazine each month. It is a fine blend of light hearted and serious, generally sceptical in tone, but for people interested in everything from bigfoot/yeti/sasquatch to ghosts, poltergeists, UFOs, conspiracy theories, Loch Ness monster...

That reminds me, Fortean TV (I think it was), was a series covering that stuff, on channel 4 (I think).

dudewithasock
2008-12-16, 08:31 PM
With the immense size of the universe, it'd be pretty egotistical of us to think that we are the only sentient beings in the cosmos. I think the existence of aliens is for sure.

As far as ghosts and stuff (this includes the idea of a god or gods), I believe in the possibility of beings like that, but not in the ability to determine whether they exist or not.

Axi
2008-12-16, 08:54 PM
aliens

Lets say, that I would be very suprised if there wouldnt be any.
There is just one thing what I dont understand: Why aliens are supernatural?
If there is an alien it is just as normal than us or other animals down here.

Five or four years ago we were in our gottage in Pohjanmaa.
It was midnight when my grandmother awaked me and sayd frightenedly that there were something on the sky. We went to peach (it was on peach of a lake) and my mother pointed to the sky and said that there were strange lights. I never really saw anything unusual, but anyway we were all REALLY frightened. We backed very fast and rushed to our car. We drowe about 100km to our friends and stayed there over night.

If I think it know, it feels extremely silly, but at that day it felt really scary.

:p:D

unibikeling
2008-12-16, 09:09 PM
ghosts Yes.

Aliens Yes.

proof of aliens - Yes very, see following picture for proof.

http://www.new-dream.de/image/wallpaper/film/stargate/stargate-sg1-06.jpg

Bondo
2008-12-16, 09:15 PM
There is no life on other planets.
If there was, I would have seen it on my wife's cell-phone bill.

catinabag1
2008-12-16, 09:21 PM
i'm unsure of the whole alien life thing. but one theory i find really cool is that there may be life anywhere, even here on earth, that exists in another dimension to us, thus mking us unaware of each other.

Into the blue
2008-12-16, 09:39 PM
That reminds me, Fortean TV (I think it was), was a series covering that stuff, on channel 4 (I think).

Gotta love the Rev Lionel Fanthorpe.

It was Bill Watterson in a classic Calvin & Hobbes strip that said "Sometimes I think the surest sign that intelligent life exists elsewhere in the universe is that none of it has tried to contact us." (http://www.cooperativeindividualism.org/calvin-on-intelligent-life.jpg)

Mikefule
2008-12-16, 09:43 PM
With the immense size of the universe, it'd be pretty egotistical of us to think that we are the only sentient beings in the cosmos.

It'd be pretty egotistical to think we're the only sentient beings on this planet. Sentient means capable of sensory perception, but even in the widely misunderstood sense of "intelligent" dolphins, some breeds of dogs, some of the great apes and some members of the crow family (jays) have been observed to have quite high levels of intelligence, including reasoning powers.

On the other hand, I think we can all think of humans who appear to lack any form of intelligence or reasoning.;)

petad
2008-12-16, 09:55 PM
I kinda agree with catinabag, there most likely is some other life out there, but it might also depend on your definition of life. It could well be so different from anything we've seen that we wouldn't recognize it. Or in other dimensions.

As for ghosts, I hadn't made up my mind until now, luckily, after a quick youtube search for "ghost", I found some p (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o4CMgRmVCEg)r (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogBp8IAtSWc&feature=related)o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rd79iI3CDxI&feature=related)o (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_xlyofmznOs&feature=related)f (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6E6TeU91FAA&feature=related).

maestro8
2008-12-16, 10:27 PM
[QUOTE=camrocl;1150870]Just wondering what your thoughts were on ghosts/ ghouls, things that go bump in the night and even aliens. Anyone experienced any of these strange encounters???/QUOTE]

People have seen Jesus in a grilled cheese sammich, and the Virgin Mary in a patch of mold.

These "sightings" are nothing more than Rorschach responses (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rorschach_inkblot_test). Everyone's going to see something different, and there is no "right answer". It's the natural response of the human brain to make sense of even the most random stimuli, and the content of that response tells you more about the person than the stimuli.

The things that go bump in the night are my cats. That one's easy. As is the ghoul phenomenon: there is no such thing as a ghost.

As for aliens, there are many many variables that lead to a damn-near-zero probability of us making any contact with them: time, space, biology, technology, etc. I wouldn't bet on there ever being contact.

1-wheeled-grape
2008-12-16, 10:37 PM
I'm sorry to say this Maestro, but I disagree with you. I'm the kind of person who likes to find logical reasons for things, which is partly why I do not belive in a god, but I do believe there are ghosts, as a definite.

I know for certain that both my houses I have lived in are haunted. In my old house there was an eight foot drop out of my dining room window to the ground where there were tractors parked. On numerous occasions a man was seen from that window, but up to his shoulders! The ground used to be higher there, and is it was a real person they would have had to walk through several tons of metal. This was seen several times when we were all sat still, eating dinner, and even before I was born. And there is a whole host of people that have seen it. Men have been reduced to hiding from that house, there was Mrs Hatches rocking chair in the corner of the room, that was seen many times rocking away... despite the face there was nothing in the corner when it was seen. I actually miss that house for all of that.
And call me weird if you will but I have spoken to ghosts, all my family have said about how when i was really young I'd have random conversations with no one, but I knew her as Mrs hatch when I spoke to her. It wasn't for years until I found she was the first owner of the house and long dead. I can remember loads of weird stuff from that house.
My new house too, If I go into my shed my dad, brother, friends all insist on making some kind of noise constantly. It creeps me out in there and I know that half of that shed was built for the previous owners son, who died when i was young. He spent ages in there. He was a good friend of my dads, as was his father. I knew the man and have home videos of him. Inface I am now sat in his old bed room, where I have been scared shitless before in here. The story is long and strange any will undoubtably think I'm an idiot if I was to tell you thst lot too. I know he is still here... for definite.
I am sure there are ghosts, from my own experiences I just know they're there. I have seen them and communicated with them and thats proof for me. I think thats what happens after death, and I will be waiting for it. I'm not religious in any way but I believe in ghosts completely.

As for Ailiens there must be something, but I cannot be as sure. This universe has so many solar systems, withso many possibilities of holding life, we just cannot see them or are yet to discover them. I'm sure one day there will be proof.

kevinalexandersmith
2008-12-17, 01:11 AM
Someone once said, ďThe universe is not only stranger than we imagine, itís stranger than we can imagine.Ē

Aliens: Probably

Ghosts that haunt houses: No
Demons: Yes

samsta002
2008-12-17, 01:23 AM
I believe in intelligent human life on earth before our race.
Also in our local "myth" (http://www.smh.com.au/news/National/Hunt-for-the-black-panther/2005/02/26/1109180165887.html)
I did a presentation on that last year and it looks like theres a family thats survived for a while with over 200 sightings in less than 100 years. and one attack on a human.

dudewithasock
2008-12-17, 01:36 AM
It'd be pretty egotistical to think we're the only sentient beings on this planet. Sentient means capable of sensory perception, but even in the widely misunderstood sense of "intelligent" dolphins, some breeds of dogs, some of the great apes and some members of the crow family (jays) have been observed to have quite high levels of intelligence, including reasoning powers.

On the other hand, I think we can all think of humans who appear to lack any form of intelligence or reasoning.;)

Lol I meant 'we' as in all the species on this planet. Sorry, should have specified.

Jeremy R
2008-12-17, 02:00 AM
Yes, I believe in Billy the Mountain.

_Ground_Zero_
2008-12-17, 02:17 AM
aliens: Yes, but just other life forms that evolved on other planets.
ghosts: Is agnostic the right term for this, or can it only be used in religion?

phlegm
2008-12-17, 02:27 AM
With the immense size of the universe, it'd be pretty egotistical of us to think that we are the only sentient beings in the cosmos. I think the existence of aliens is for sure.

I saw a bumper sticker yesterday that read, "Think Globally, Act Locally". It made me wonder if the driver of the vehicle really has something against extra-terrestrials to not include them when deliberating about ethical action.

tumblebug rollin
2008-12-18, 10:23 PM
If one considers the tremendous size of the universe and the comparative inconsequentil size of the submicroscopic dust mote we call earth; it seems likely that there may be other life (intelligent or otherwise) in the universe. The corollary to this statement is that unless other heretofore undiscovered but highly postulated laws of physicis can be brought to bear; it don't matter.
The distances are so vast that we probably will never have contact.
If the previously postulated physical remedies for the great distances do exist, we may have used up our available fuel and other resources and be incapable of the trip, as in the case of the Easter Islanders before the arrival of Europeans. They had cut down their forests and were effecticvely marooned on Easter Island even though they had had the technology to build ocean going vessles.

unifreak7
2008-12-18, 11:19 PM
I'm sorry John F. physics will always be fact... (don't relate aliens to 9/11 either John. That's just being silly. Like I said there is physics proof on 9/11. You either just can't understand physics are refuse to believe it)

Why answer yes/no to these questions? Why not try to explain them. Astroprojection has been successful in the past. What if upon death your body can output enough concentrated energy to perverse a weak image of you (ghost) doing some repeating like. Usually it's always the people that die in untimely fashions that get this (but not always). Which, if murdered, would certainly have a higher output of energy and stress, therefore perversing some sort of image into the room/house/area. Also your mind can make you believe anything. If enough people believe it, their grouped minds can make instances to prove their theory (it's probably why religion has taken off so well). So if enough people claim they see a ghost, more people will see it too.

Aliens... OF COURSE! Those who don't think there are, are highly underestimating the size of our universe. No local aliens though, sorry. We will receive their radio waves much before we get alien life to visit. Keep in mind every star has a pretty large zone of life (a zone of which water can be in liquid form, depends on satelites atmosphere). There are many many stars and the majority of all stars have satelites orbiting around them. In which, because of the vast amount of stars, a vast amount of satelites have to be in that life zone of some star or another. So yeah, pretty easy to believe for me. Surely no arrival of any other intelligent life though in humans' existance.

catinabag1
2008-12-18, 11:35 PM
even if the universe is as immense as it is, think about how complicated even a cell is let alone a multicelled organism. a friend of mine kind of explained it pretty well, he said it is like putting parts of a watch in a bag and shaking it up and out comes a built watch. the chances of this happening are next to none and life is WAAAYY more complicated than a watch.

Mikefule
2008-12-19, 05:35 PM
even if the universe is as immense as it is, think about how complicated even a cell is let alone a multicelled organism. a friend of mine kind of explained it pretty well, he said it is like putting parts of a watch in a bag and shaking it up and out comes a built watch. the chances of this happening are next to none and life is WAAAYY more complicated than a watch.

No.

At the very least, your analogy needs an infinite number of bags of watch parts, and you just notice the one or two that do fit together and ignore the millions that don't. Even then, it's far from a perfect analogy, but better.

johnfoss
2008-12-19, 06:04 PM
Like I said there is physics proof on 9/11. You either just can't understand physics are refuse to believe itOr you refuse to share your "proof". Why did you stop posting in those threads? Put up or shut up. Back to topic...
Also your mind can make you believe anything.Ding! Certainly can. :)
If enough people believe it, their grouped minds can make instances to prove their theory (it's probably why religion has taken off so well). So if enough people claim they see a ghost, more people will see it too.I think you're dead right on this one. When enough people believe something is true, even without a scrap of evidence, there is a tendency for the group to grow in size, adding more people who believe the same thing(s). I don't know the psychology word for it, but there must be one.

And these large groups can be very influential, as can any large group, both politically and socially.
No local aliens though, sorry. Surely no arrival of any other intelligent life though in humans' existance.And this goes to show that though someone might be deluded by one set of beliefs-without-fact, they may be quite immune to others.

So how do you know there haven't been any visits here by aliens? If you just think there haven't been (what you believe), I think I'm with you on that. But we can't know. I just know that the vast majority of alien/UFO sightings are a load of BS.

Really smart aliens can probably walk among us without being noticed, or observe us without being detected. And if they want to mess with our heads by making lights dart around the sky in non-ballistic motion, maybe they are testing us? Maybe it's the test that determines whether they should formally contact us? In that case, we're definitely not smarter than a fifth grader. :p

Spudman
2008-12-19, 06:30 PM
I'm sorry John F. physics will always be fact... (don't relate aliens to 9/11 either John. That's just being silly. Like I said there is physics proof on 9/11. You either just can't understand physics are refuse to believe it)

Why answer yes/no to these questions? Why not try to explain them. Astroprojection has been successful in the past. What if upon death your body can output enough concentrated energy to perverse a weak image of you (ghost) doing some repeating like. Usually it's always the people that die in untimely fashions that get this (but not always). Which, if murdered, would certainly have a higher output of energy and stress, therefore perversing some sort of image into the room/house/area. Also your mind can make you believe anything. If enough people believe it, their grouped minds can make instances to prove their theory (it's probably why religion has taken off so well). So if enough people claim they see a ghost, more people will see it too.

Aliens... OF COURSE! Those who don't think there are, are highly underestimating the size of our universe. No local aliens though, sorry. We will receive their radio waves much before we get alien life to visit. Keep in mind every star has a pretty large zone of life (a zone of which water can be in liquid form, depends on satelites atmosphere). There are many many stars and the majority of all stars have satelites orbiting around them. In which, because of the vast amount of stars, a vast amount of satelites have to be in that life zone of some star or another. So yeah, pretty easy to believe for me. Surely no arrival of any other intelligent life though in humans' existance.

This post made my day.

kevinalexandersmith
2008-12-19, 08:55 PM
Also your mind can make you believe anything Ding! Certainly can.or it can make you disbelieve and deny anything. Do I get a ding too?:o

maestro8
2008-12-19, 11:17 PM
What if upon death your body can output enough concentrated energy to perverse a weak image of you (ghost) doing some repeating like.

There is no way you can claim to know anything about physics if you're going to post drivel such as this.

As always, we'll give you a chance to explain yourself. Energy is one of the foundational concepts of physics... tell us what form of energy a body might output, and how it might manifest as you're claiming.

We'll be waiting for your answer. Just like we're waiting for your "9/11 equation".

unibikeling
2008-12-20, 12:12 AM
Why answer yes/no to these questions? Why not try to explain them. Astroprojection has been successful in the past. What if upon death your body can output enough concentrated energy to perverse a weak image of you (ghost) doing some repeating like. Usually it's always the people that die in untimely fashions that get this (but not always). Which, if murdered, would certainly have a higher output of energy and stress, therefore perversing some sort of image into the room/house/area. Also your mind can make you believe anything. If enough people believe it, their grouped minds can make instances to prove their theory (it's probably why religion has taken off so well). So if enough people claim they see a ghost, more people will see it too.


I agree.

*ahem*

wobbling bear
2008-12-20, 01:11 PM
when I was an architect I thought that a client was about to sue me because I had built him a haunted house :eek: (I have my own theories on why the family were feeling ghosts all around: but I agree with Mikefule though there are no such thing as an actual ghost lot of people feel them)
so he sold the house and the next owners lived happily there ....

Mikefule
2008-12-20, 03:17 PM
The existence of ghosts in the sense of "souls surviving and manifesting as visible or audible phenomena after the death of the body" runs contrary to basic principles of physics as well as presenting what many regard as insuperable objections philosophically and even mathematically.

A lot of enthusiastic people with a vested interest in proving the existence of ghosts have spent time, money and effort trying to produce evidence for the existence of ghosts, and they have failed.

But nevertheless, a wide range of people from a wide range of cultures report seeing or hearing ghosts.

I think it is fair to say that most of those people are not lying. They are telling the truth as they experience it.

The human mind is very good at seeing patterns and making connections - which is why you can see faces in the clouds and hear voices in the wind.

I think that if a person believes in ghosts, as a result of his cultural background, then he will "see" ghosts when the conditions are right. The right conditions are when he has a set of sense perceptions which do not fit his day to day experience, and which the mind can "construct" into a ghost sighting.

Ducttape
2008-12-21, 01:08 PM
ghosts: maybe
Demons:yes
Angels:there's always gotta be an opposing force right?
Aliens: yeup for sure (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Multiverse)

Triball
2008-12-21, 03:24 PM
Are aliens considered to be supernatural?

Mikefule
2008-12-21, 09:54 PM
Are aliens considered to be supernatural?

No.

Any useful definition of "supernatural" surely implies something that is beyond our present scientific understanding of how things are on Earth. It doesn't have to include ghosts and vampires, but things like visions, superstitions, out of body experiences and so on all fall withing the general catchment of "supernatural".

A simple definition of "alien" (in the sense I think you you mean it) is a creature from another planet. Creatures from other planets are not "known" to exist, but they would not be outside our present scientific understanding or expectations if they did.