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  • Fluck 2007 - Koxx1

    I'm sure that everybody on here that attended Fluck 2007 noticed that there were some problems involving Koxx1. I don’t understand French but from what I can tell here, some of the French seem to be going a bit over the top. “Fuck Fluck” and I have even seen pictures of t-shirts on people’s msn windows saying “Fluck Jens 2007" with the L crossed out in “Fluck”. Personally, I think that’s well out of order and I’m wondering what everybody else’s views on this are. This thread is going to certainly be very subjective, but it’ll be interesting to hear what people think.

    Here is what it seemed to me
    - Koxx arrived to Fluck and although having not sponsored anything towards the convention, they hung K1 banners all around the trials parcours.
    - They refused to pay the entrance fee to the convention.
    - They used illegal drugs on the premises of the convention.
    - After being asked to leave the convention, they returned and this caused delay to the trials competition.

    I think that’s pretty much all that K1 did wrong. (Not all of them. Tom Pec, and Joe Hodges had nothing to do with the above).

    The thing that got me most withsome of the French was the lack of respect for Jens, one of the organisers. On the final night, somebody made a speech saying thanks to Jens for spending the best part of a year to organise the convention. The cheers and claps start and then all of a sudden the hall is filled with boos and hisses by none other than angry French people. Surely that’s not right?

    From a conversation on msn with an anonymous French person:

    - “I didn’t enjoy the convention”. So why did you stay for the duration?
    - “We decided to stay to the end, not doing the same as Jens”. Purposefully disruptive?
    - “On the last days they took out a whip”. WTH?
    - “The French sometimes called him Hitler”. Sounds respectful.
    - “But at the end he had a whistle and it was no voluntary help”. Is it so bad to be expected to help out with the communal clear up after a week of not being asked to do anything besides have fun?

    I’m starting this thread because I feel pretty annoyed at the way people have acted following this convention. I feel people have been incredibly rude and disrespectful towards a man that put a lot of effort into making the best convention of the year (in my opinion).

    Amanda
    unicycle.com

  • #2
    Originally posted by amanda.gallacher
    a lot
    Completly agreed, though most of this happened before I got to Fluck, I think I heard most of it. Koxx One was asked to leave for several reasons, most of them valid (in my opinion), only one of them in a gray area, which is the admittance fee. From how I heard it, there were a few non-riders accompanying the french, and they didn't use the facilities (food, drink, course), and only those didn't pay. I think they could've found something in between paying the full price, and paying nothing. Again, I wasn't there when it happened, I'm basing this on hear-say. But in the end, the decision by Jens was totally justified, based even on the stuff besides not paying.

    I just hope we can all get along at next conventions. Stick to the rules, and laws, and it'll all be fine I guess.

    Edit:

    One more thing, Koxx showing up at the trialsconvention was slightly childish, but the decision of the organisers to postpone the trialscompetition was equally childish, in my opinion. There would've been no harm done by just contuining the trialscompetition, and letting me have my meal at 6, instead of 7. I'd gotten very hungry... :P
    Last edited by Erant; 2007-07-17, 05:28 PM.
    "There is power in your wall sockets, too, but I don't recommend that you plug yourself in to learn a 540 unispin." - Harper

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    • #3
      I think the organisation as well as Koxx-One were behaving a bit childishly, I know it's probably not what you mean but it sounds like you're kind of discriminating the French, there are definitely some quality French people out there who probably felt a bit attacked? I don't think anyone actually knows what happened exactly.
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      • #4
        Originally posted by amanda.gallacher
        “Fuck Fluck” and I have even seen pictures of t-shirts on people’s msn windows saying “Fluck Jens 2007" with the L crossed out in “Fluck”.

        Here is what it seemed to me
        - Koxx arrived to Fluck and although having not sponsored anything towards the convention, they hung K1 banners all around the trials parcours.
        - They refused to pay the entrance fee to the convention.
        - They used illegal drugs on the premises of the convention.
        - After being asked to leave the convention, they returned and this caused delay to the trials competition.


        The thing that got me most withsome of the French was the lack of respect for Jens, one of the organisers. On the final night, somebody made a speech saying thanks to Jens for spending the best part of a year to organise the convention. The cheers and claps start and then all of a sudden the hall is filled with boos and hisses by none other than angry French people. Surely that’s not right?
        Wow, some of that is worse then I had thought.

        It's a shame Jens had to deal with all this, he went to an awful lot of trouble for this convention and I agree completely with the way he handled the situation. It's his convention, he gets to make the rules.


        I realize that there are perfectly err, 'innocent', French Koxx-1 riders, but this whole thing for the most part makes them look bad, and justifiably so. Sorry to any Koxx-1 riders who had nothing to do with this, but that's just the way it goes.




        Not that I intended to before, but now I will never buy any Koxx-1 products, simply because their company/management/whatever stinks.
        Last edited by forrestunifreak; 2007-07-17, 05:53 PM.
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        • #5
          Originally posted by forrestunifreak
          but this whole thing for the most part makes them look bad.
          Oh? For me there's too much contradiction, suggestive and personal opinion, and irrelevant and/or anonymous nonsense in the 1st post for them to look that bad to me.
          Still a shame things went this way.
          Last edited by leo; 2007-07-17, 06:01 PM.
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          • #6
            Originally posted by DustinSchaap
            I think the organisation as well as Koxx-One were behaving a bit childishly, I know it's probably not what you mean but it sounds like you're kind of discriminating the French, there are definitely some quality French people out there who probably felt a bit attacked? I don't think anyone actually knows what happened exactly.
            Hey yeah dustin, didnt mean it if it sounds like im discriminating the French, I think I put "some of the French" so thought that was clear I didn't mean all. I met some quality French people and hope they aren't offended with what I have said.

            Also, I started this thread because I wanna know the truth to what happened. I know what I said can't be 100% true, so if I'm wrong please say and I will gladly take back any accusations I have made.
            unicycle.com

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            • #7
              Originally posted by DustinSchaap
              I don't think anyone actually knows what happened exactly.
              SOMEBODY does, but I'll start by saying it definitely isn't me. I was not there, so I'll keep my opinions very minimal.

              The convention host "owns" the event. He (assuming it is one, male person) went to all the trouble to set it up, provide information, rent facilities, answer a million questions, etc. Also he is *responsible* for those facilities, as well as for putting on the event he has described and promised when he collected entry fees from people. Therefore the convention host *must* reserve the right to ask people to leave. If those people choose not to leave, it just damages the event for everyone; the hosts, the people who paid entry fees, the people who practiced hard, etc.

              Banners:
              If there weren't any policies to begin with, all that should happen is for the host to ask unauthorized vendors to take them down (or make a deal for keeping them up). If the vendor does not take them down, the hosts should be able to take them down themselves and store them in a "safe" place until the end of the convention.

              Illegal activities:
              I don't know the laws of other countries, but if it's illegal, I don't think there should be a question of why someone is being asked to leave.

              General rudeness:
              What goes around comes around.

              Of what I've heard, much may be rumor or exaggerated. People may have the wrong information about whose idea it was to do various things. Before holding Koxx management responsible I'd wait for them to have a chance to respond. One honest response by someone in charge might clear the whole thing up. Until then, I'm going to assume much of these bad activities were done by people who do not officially represent Koxx.

              Next year:
              Unicon, in the same country. I hope Koxx will be welcome, because I love watching their guys ride, and much of the outlandish and fun stuff they do (though I've seen enough of Yoggi's privates). I'm sure this can be cleared up by then. If not, I certainly hope we don't get more of what I read about above.
              Last edited by johnfoss; 2007-07-17, 06:05 PM.
              John Foss
              www.unicycling.com

              "Who is going to argue with a mom who can ride a unicycle?" -- Forums member "HiMo"

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              • #8
                I agree with you that it was bad that some people from k1 smoked inside, maybe its a reason to throw them out of the convention, but im not sure, since the stories i've heard from the two sides are completely different.
                (Fluck said they smoked hash, even though they told them not too, k1 said they smoked cigarettes, and that Jensbirk did as well)

                About the "not wanting to pay-"thing, i have tried to figure out what it was all about, and my conclusion, which is my own one, (and might is totally wrong) is, that Fluck already before the french guys came thought the french guys probably would try to chead them as much as they could get away with, and therefore fluck didnt believe that the non-unicycling visitors actually really was non-unicycling visitors.
                That is the only explanation i can find that makes a little sence.

                What really makes me angry about this story is the way both parts chose to react. The french guys who stayed at the convention was very unkind to one of the makers of the convention, and the way they behaved at the show was very bad too.
                That Jensbirk, as k1 shows up at the trialcompetion, tells in danish (what luckily wasnt translated into other languages as far as i understood) that k1 are selling drugs to the other participants is very very bad and a lie you shouldnt tell about anyone, no matter what they've done!!!!!
                Also, that he is telling people that they can leave the convention if they disagree with him, if they talk to the k1 team, is a wrong way to behave in my opinion.

                I actually felt like Jensbirk didnt allow people to have their own opinion. I was afraid to say that i didnt agree with him, because i was afraid he then would tell me to leave. That made me frustrated and very angry.

                Dont get me wrong, i think jensbirk and the rest of the fluck-team made a wonderful convention and i enjoyed it very much, and i know he did it all because he thought it was the best way to react.
                At the same time i still love the french people very much, they are all great guys and their way of life, like invite strangers from switzerland to come and enjoy fluck with them is great, and it is very said that this didnt work out.

                At last, to all the french people who are reading this:
                UNICON 14 in copenhagen are not planned by the same people at all, so dont boycut it, you will regret.

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                • #9
                  I've just had a conversation with another french person in msn and they have agreed to allow me to post this

                  "The koxx team did want to pay the convention. There were people with them who had nothing to do with unicycling, friends of them and they didn't want to pay cause they wouldn't have used all the stuff of the convention. Yeah, koxx use drugs but from what i've heard jens himself smoked cannabis inside the gymnasium. From what I’ve understood, jens had a kind of discrimination against French.

                  Enzo Ventura made the street comp. Jens wanted to get rid of him just because he spoke with two koxx riders. I think there was a lot of provoking from the French to jens but I think it was justified. Jens just chose people he didn’t like and made reason to get rid of them. "
                  unicycle.com

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                  • #10
                    Its sad that stuff like this happened in the unicycling scene, which always seemed like a big family to me. I dont know exactly what happened there but I think Jens did the best to avoid conflicts during the convention by asking them to leave and he definitely had good reasons for that.
                    It's understandable that other people werent happy with that decission but its wrong to show it with "booh"s and provocations.
                    Next time there should be more sportmanship and everyone should accept laws and rules so that we can enjoy a convention without any conflicts and disruptions.
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                    • #11
                      I just want to remark that most of the koxx-one people stayed at Fluck, from what I know only Yoggi, Matt and some friends leaved (Thorsten, Tom, Joe, Joe B., Loic, Arthur and Martin stayed).

                      I dont have a realy opinion too the decision at the moment. But I think it is so stupid that a danish Girl now must write, please dont boycot our Unicon. I dont think that the french unicyclists will do something like this only because a few french guys went in trouble.
                      lutzeichholz.de

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                      • #12
                        do you know that organisators wanted to elimated peoples of the competition because they were with koxx team?
                        do you know that a menber of the unicycle fakse club was expleded of this club for the same reason ?
                        do you know that jens's son took a whip in order to " motivated "when everybody were carying paletts ?do you know that he was extremly agressive when some body didn't think like his father ?

                        do you know that i'm pretty bad in english ?yes you know and that's why i don"t write more
                        samiaul, from keukly french team

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by recommanded poster
                          do you know that a menber of the unicycle fakse club was expleded of this club for the same reason ?
                          Yes, and this is one of the things that made me angry. You are not allowed to have a different opinion than Jens, which only make people wanting to do what they "are not allowed to" even more.
                          btw, he was the coolest boy i have ever met, he told the people who were kicked out that they could come and sleep in his guesthouse, and he invited them all to dinner the last evening

                          He is my man!!

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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by amanda.gallacher
                            Yeah, koxx use drugs but from what i've heard jens himself smoked cannabis inside the gymnasium.
                            That clearly doesn't mean that it was OK for Koxx to bring drugs into the scene. Logical fallacy of appeal to popularity. It's still immature on Koxx's part to bring them, but also immature if Jens did it himself, but it sounds more like made up rumor about Jens than anything else.

                            I'm not saying that I know whether he did or not, but it is way to easy to say a little lie just to use an obvious logical fallacy to make them seem more justified.
                            Nothing is better than than eternal happiness, and a ham sandwich is better than nothing, therefore a ham sandwich is better than eternal happiness.

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                            • #15
                              I'm finding this thread reali interesting. There is a lot of underlying information that was not apparant to most participants. I'm beginning to see other sides to what happened and that's good.
                              unicycle.com

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